*enthusiastic* consent; the new paradigm to adopt

[labelleizzy]

I want to thank tenacious_snail for introducing me to the concept of enthusiastic consent. I've been thinking about it a lot recently.
Her way of putting it, was "I have a fetish for consent", actually. I like this as well.

Just before the holidays, someone I should have been able to trust, put his hands on me, not just without my consent, but in a surprising way, from BEHIND ME, where I could not see him or be warned in any way.

This is the fifth time he has done this over ten years, in the exact same kind of way. Always from behind. Always in my blind spot. Always silently and without warning, he plops his heavy hands down onto my shoulders. *shudder* I don't see him often thank the gods. But he will NEVER do this again. I was already angry and unhappy with him due to his prior history with me and stories I have heard from others about similar behavior towards other women, and I had been very cold towards him, shielded and painfully polite during the visit so far.

This last time he did this he did it in the crowded basement and came up behind me, directly in front of his sons: my husband and my brother in law. It felt like some combination of a horrible creepy crawlie landing on my skin and like ropes starting to be tying my arms to my upper body. I had a full-body shudder, moving forward in the crowded room while ducking and batting his hands and arms away from me, saying, "no, stop, I don't want this, don't touch me!"

ew ew ew ew ew.

I put Jeff between him and me for the remainder of the evening, and he didn't make eye contact for the rest of the evening either; he was holding his grandson at the far end of the table. And when it came time for parting and good byes, he strangely was not in the room.

GOOD.

He still is owed a long email. I'm working on how to say things that might get him to actually fucking CHANGE his behavior rather than totally just shred him, which I am perfectly capable of doing, mind you. But I've had about three weeks to think about things. He's in his sixties, stuck in his ways almost to the point of fossilization, basically a social pariah. I can't change him, but this is a HARD LIMIT and he will NOT touch me again. If I can introduce a fracture, I will. I plan to.


*inhale*
*exhale*

This was not actually the post I meant to be writing, but it is pertinent and related.

What I wanted to talk about is that it is fucking CRUCIAL to ensure enthusiastic consent with people you want to connect with.

Even for a handshake. *shrug* I forced an introductory handshake on someone once and realized after the fact that his culture did not DO that kind of thing. Awkward, but hopefully not wounding.

Even for a hug. My friend N used to have another friend who insisted on hugs, even when she wasn't wanting to hug them. N will hug me, usually... the first time though, I offered and she initially said NO.

and it's so goddam important to respect the NO.

I said NO a dozen times to the asshole who date raped me in college. He ran right over the top of my NO. I was barely 21 years old. I presumed basic respect, and did not have the tools to handle a situation beyond my assumption parameters. (I'm okay now, but I'm still ANGRY about him forcing unwanted sexual activity.)

Our culture does not respect the NO. Too many romance novels and comedies have the love interest "sweeping someone off their feet", saving them in some damsel in distress trope, "earning their love" through defeating or humiliating enemies or rivals or getting past obstacles. There's a deep stream that says "do what you can get away with", witness subway creepers, upskirt photographers, catcalling on urban streets, drugging drinks in fraternities and bars.

I REJECT THESE TROPES.

I want to see more people learning the delicate dance of exploring and respecting others. Of seeking the people who enthusiastically want you in their community, people who you want in yours. Enthusiastically taking someone into your life, or your bed or your body, and them being as enthusiastic to be there as you are enthusiastic about wanting them.

I *will* take lukewarm hugs, and lukewarm acquaintance if that's all I can get.

I think I can do better than that, though, honestly. I'm pretty awesome. =) If you're not into me, why spend the time? That's just dumb and kind of a waste for both of us. Find something that sets you on fire, inspires you.

I will not take lukewarm lovers, and I will not pressure someone into being with me unless they're actually, really into me. I'm willing to be patient though and let a good deep secure friendship make slow progress toward something else. I can gently express my enthusiasm about the person I am into, and let them gradually dig me more until maybe they are enthusiastic about me, too. Someone who is enthusiastic about me, who will treat me as I deserve to be treated: with attention, time, tenderness, touch, and sweetness.

And I have to understand that I need to enforce my own No, too. If spending time somewhere or with someone is unproductive, unrewarding, uncomfortable or unfulfilling for me, I need to say NO as often as possible. Sometimes you can't do that, life is complicated. But you can often make choices to do the things that feed you rather than the things that drain you or doing stupid stuff because it's a habit.

Make more CONSCIOUS choices. Cultivate the relationships you really want instead of settling.
If something doesn't work to feed you, prune it out of your life. It's deadwood anyway, why should it stay if you can make room for actual growth, more sunlight, more breathing room. It can be awkward, painful, uncomfortable to do.

Can we all speak up a little more?
"yeah, I really love spending time with you."
"no, I don't have the interest in doing that, thank you for asking."
"hey, could you scratch my back? (rub my feet, pet my hair, help me with task x)?"

Be specific. Address the individual person or persons at stake. Be honest. Be kind if you can spare the spoons, if you can't be kind at least be direct and clear.

That's what I want to see. That's what I want to try to do.


Thoughts??

Comments

[daphnep.livejournal.com]

"Our culture does not respect the no."

Thank you for saying this. It helps frame an uneasiness I have for a lot of things I see on tv and in movies, where overriding a woman's refusal is used as a joke, or a plot turn, without framing it as molestation...even from sources that purport to be progressive or forward-thinking. "Our culture does not respect the no" is such a concise framework for that grossness, and gives me a way to start conversations about it next time this comes up.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

damn.
thank you for saying so.
sometimes I find really good words when I get my rant on.
Happy to have been of service!

[jadefalcon01.livejournal.com]

I've seen it put "When a man says no it's the end of the discussion. When a woman says no it's the opening of negotiations."

I feel gross even typing that, in no small part because of how true it is.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

I have indeed experienced this in more contexts than one.
*sigh*

[gira.livejournal.com]

semi-related tangent: I recently had a whole conversation with my lover about how I find myself wanting him to initiate touch and initiate [other things] with me and how frustrating it is to me that I do all these things for him to make him feel wanted, but he doesn't do any of them for me.

And he shared how the fear of rejection, because his ex wife had him conditioned not to ever approach her even for affection by accusing him of "always wanting sex" as if it were a bad thing, keeps him from trying. And he is making an effort.

But I realized something important a couple nights later, having had that conversation, when we reached the point in the evening where we would typically have [other activities] without him initiating any kind of foreplay, instead I reached for a bottle of massage oil and ordered him to rub my front down. And he did.

So all this time I had been stewing, not once had it occurred to me that I could ask for what I wanted. I thought we had to have this big discussion about my needs not being met - and a poly discussion about whether it was fair to want him to meet them or whether I should just take another lover, because, you know, you can't ask one person for everything! Not if you're a good poly!

And it was really so simple as asking for what I DID want rather than #processing and #hashingitout and #intellectualizing a want. My therapist did her part too, in pointing out that I wasn't really asking for foreplay, I was asking for more intimacy. That clarity helped a lot.

All of that to say: I think it's ok to say what you don't want.

"Please don't touch me EVER unless I initiate contact. It makes me [anxious, terrified, angry] and that's not how I want to feel about you. If I want a hug from you, I will come to you, but other than that, keep your hands to yourself." And outline a consequence for failing to respect that boundary if you want to.

There's no obligation to explain the whys or the reasons or the rationale. It's how you want to be treated and you're entitled to that. You get to have your healthy boundaries. <3 You get to have agency over your own body. You deserve to feel safe.

[starseeking.livejournal.com]

"And he shared how the fear of rejection, because his ex wife had him conditioned not to ever approach her even for affection by accusing him of "always wanting sex" as if it were a bad thing, keeps him from trying."

I never had an ex-wife, but this is a few chapters from my life..

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

oh yeah. HUG.

dealing with a mild case of this myself.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

I think my post lacks a single coherent thesis, lol...

1) yeah, I think it's a good idea to ask for what you want. my difficulty, and one I would love to have a discussion (IM, FB, skype) with you about, is saying, "I want this or need this from you" and dealing with the fear of No. I have that fear with every. single. person I am currently intimate or want to be intimate with.

2) fuck yeah I can say things I don't want. I don't fucking want him to touch me ever again. I fucking want him to own up to his own unacceptable behavior and I am currently planning on holding him to a higher standard. He's not christian or pagan or devotedly atheist or anything but a narcissist/solipsist, as far as I can tell. So leverage will be difficult. We will see what we will see.

[jadefalcon01.livejournal.com]

Part of your communication to him might need to include the hard limit of "don't ever touch me again", with the promise (not threat) of physically damaging repercussions possibly included as well.

It's unlikely he will change in general, but if you are sufficiently forcible with the credible expectation of physical violence if he further disregards your wishes then his self-preservation instinct might be awakened just enough to keep his disgusting claws off of you.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

I don't think anyone has had enough distance from him before to act as a mirror he couldn't fucking ignore.

I shine like the sun. I will help him SEE.

[anita-margarita.livejournal.com]

He CAN change but he may not WANT to. But that isn't your responsibility - your responsibility is to protect yourself and any other person that may be in his sight.

What kind of society do we have when he tell little girls, "He likes you - that's why he hit you"?

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

right. "boys will be boys" is the shorthand I hear in the feminist blogosphere.

well, NO. children will be children, and can be socialized to become decent human beings, not selfish uncontrolled little gits. That goes for girls and boys equally.

[hitchhiker.livejournal.com]

amen

[cheshire23.livejournal.com]

I think there is a problem with the lack of respect for "no" but I also think that for some of us, at least, and at the risk of TMI, there is a problem with the soundbite version of "enthusiastic consent" for some of us who are either slower to warm up but will be quite happy once we get going or whose "enthusiasm" is tempered by the need to take care around pain/disability issues.

I think consent can be real and clear without fitting the stereotypical enthusiastic mold - I tend to have the milder, "yeah, OK, I think I could get into this" a lot of time at the beginning and having to be in insta-"YES TAKE ME NOW!" mode would definitely make my sex life worse, not better.

See also this post from Pervocracy, which says things better than I can.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

MMM! yeah, *real* consent, in the context of this thing I wrote, matches what Pervocracy says in their post.

also: what you describe about your sexual consent sound like *real* consent in Pervocracy's way of thinking, and that's what I'm looking for.

[starseeking.livejournal.com]

This was very well written.

Also, I enjoy hugs and want them at every opportunity from people I'm comfortable with, but I never feel comfortable letting people know. :/

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

fortunately I am both a big hugger and big on asking for hello and goodbye hugs. Even from new people, sometimes!
I realized I have a much better chance at asking for what I want if I actually let people know that I want it. Still not perfect, not even close. But I'm working on it.

here have a Zen hug from faraway California.
(((starseeking)))

[elven-ranger.livejournal.com]

I think it will be important to stress that you will not allow anything like this again, and that if he does, relevant action will be taken. Either self-defence, or official.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

I think I'm just going to say he's stood on my last nerve and he gets no more chances. Period.

However he does need to stop being such a dillweed so I will be writing that email between now and the new year.

[anwyn-elfmaiden.livejournal.com]

I hate this, too, when people with creepy energy touch me. Christian told my brother in law's father off for touching him all the time. He still is a bit upset that Christian dared to tell him off.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

*dared* tell him off.

That's the thing, really.
Fucker. Nobody is ENTITLED TO ANYBODY'S BODY. except their own body. That someone would feel that way indicates the Person has a fucked up entitled headspace (No, Liz, tell us how you REALLY feel).

And I am currently battling my own hormones against the strongest crush I have had in a decade, to not be That Guy who convinces or coerces someone into something they may be lukewarm about or not into at all. (god I wish I were telepathic just for a moment so I could KNOW if I had a chance with my crush at all).

Asking is hard. But you have to do it, to be truly Ethical. I am currently engaging All The Self Control.

Touch is equally healing or damaging. Desire is what makes or breaks it.

[capybyra.livejournal.com]

I see it as case for fair warning of physical damage to him= If the stated intent of filed battery charges do not work.. you will hurt him in self-defense. Thence it's his choice- hands off- or legal-or pain consequences.

What I most ABHOR about perps is their claiming power to steal our joy. I hold that saying NO to THEM is almost a duty. Even up to and including removing them from our lives- or theirs if they press it. Perhaps I'm being under dramatic about it?

All that aside- the inverse realms where enthusiasm in sincere desire is SHARED.. No shared desire= no unrequested touching!

That sort of mindfulness -is mayhaps the single demarcations of honor that I judge folks on. I see in your intent of ENTHUSIASM for relationship... a path of yes meaning a mutual *YES*

You've restored an old soul's faith in people of this world "Getting It" on romance let alone Love...

I've no magic wand to banish all that's wronged you. Then again- I see you crafted a hope of healing relationships. I've been married damn near half my life. And hope to be so for all of it. I'm SO hoping you find a true Lifemate who will Cherish you "as-Is" with respect for your feelings- on touch and ALL things.

EDIT: I hope to phrase that as you "currently and ALWAYS" having a Lifemate:>

Re: Touch is equally healing or damaging. Desire is what makes or breaks it.

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

currently and always having a Lifemate: from your mouth to the Gods' ears, may it be so.

your subject line is right on the money, dear. thanks for being concise.

[mac-arthur-park.livejournal.com]

It's interesting to read this (I'm catching up with LJ) right now. I had the oddest dream the other night where I was giving a talk at a college on consent. It left me with many thinky-thoughts. I really need to write out my thoughts on what consent means in terms of my personal boundaries (I tend to "be nice" even when not interested).

I will applaud my subconscious for adding the other weird twist that my partner for how to handle certain situations was my current crush object. *cringe*

[labelleizzy.livejournal.com]

You can't know what a relief it is to know that someone else is undergoing this IN REAL TIME the same time I am.

I *must* be an ethical poly but gosh sometimes....
*flops back on the bed in despair*

[mac-arthur-park.livejournal.com]

In my dream--I kid you not--I looked at this guy and thought "Who decided that an ethical bi poly kinky slut and a queer boi-lesque Neil Diamond impersonating stripper is qualified to do this?"

[meri-sielu.livejournal.com]

I agree whole heartedly with everything you have written here and am sorry that you have experienced such a violation of comfort and personal space. I hope that eventually this man will learn to back off and respect your boundaries, regardless of his age. There's just no excuse for behaviour like that. *hugs*

[temperance14.livejournal.com]

Oh hell yes. Theme for the year.

[lb-lee.livejournal.com]

I HATE people touching me without permission. I can handle handshakes and that's pretty much my limit. Thankfully, these days nobody tries to grab me unless they're sidewalk creepers; everyone I associate with is generally okay with it.

I mean, I appreciate the sentiment. It's just that it's really, really uncomfortable for me, unless you are really, really close to me. Even my close friends, I don't hug much, and I'm okay with that.

--Rogan